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A Cheap Win

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Bosephine, Oct 6, 2015.

?

A cheap win is...

  1. a win all the same

    16 vote(s)
    36.4%
  2. hallow and meaningless

    28 vote(s)
    63.6%
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  1. Bosephine

    Bosephine User

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    One man’s cheap win is another man’s smart move, however some examples of a cheap win include:

    1. Ganking a wartag significantly lower level than you
    2. Sending 2 parties for 1 enemy party (already at a disadvantage since they’re exp’ing)
    3. Flagging someone with a lowbie, then killing them with a high level character
    4. Cheat programs

    Feel free to comment on the subject. Whenever I score a cheap win it feels hallow and meaningless, yet I know some good people who would say it’s a win all the same. They relish it in fact, because when scoring a cheap win, their opponent tends to cry harder.
     
  2. Bosephine

    Bosephine User

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    I won't apologize for being curious about the world around me and willing to ask questions and learn about things.

    If you don't understand why I'm curious then it's best you just ignore the post. If you have a specific question, then ask.
     
  3. albers

    albers User

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    I rather have a fight than easy stomp.
     
  4. TerraKill

    TerraKill User

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    Here's a few massively troll moves,
    • Big monster train, fake death in the middle of an un-expecting Exp'in party preferably resting or already mid fight, Stand up collect items :56:

    • Stun someone fighting or fleeing a monster, watch patiently, collect items and watch dead person :120:


    But buffers and healers don't get any fun you ask?
    • Stand back all innocently :36: watching a group pulling a group of mobs, as the tank pulls the monsters into the group, start buffing the monsters and healing them too, collect your spoils and :93: don't forget to ask them if they need to be revived for exp back or buffs for adena after.

    Most people would consider these acts foul play:59:

    So don't expect finding a exp party / raid / mass pvp easy for yourself if you portray these acts.
    would be a lonely roads for those who take it :3:
     
  5. Norz!

    Norz! User

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    I'm gonna have to ask you to hand over your men club's card Sir, this is way more Anime smileys than allowed by our code.
     
    Abuse and deadmaker like this.
  6. Jad o

    Jad o User

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    On devianne, bsoe'ing and party recall was so much frowned upon that it almost never happend in PvP during C1-Interlude. When it did happen, those people and clan were made fun of constantly to the point some of the more hardcore players among them would start hating on their own carebear clannies and mates. This is probably an impossible dream to achieve on a classic server, because exp will be that much harder to come by and it can't be expected from all of us old men to be as hardcore as we used to be. Still to me, bsoe'ing and party recall are cheap.
     
  7. Hartassen

    Hartassen User

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    It depends on the situation. BSOE'ing when 1v3 is hardly cheap. Party recalling as a 9 man party when 20+ people come running is hardly cheap. Of course you can always stay and fight, there are those who do. But chances are if you are exping in the same spot you're equal levels and therefore you're at an inherent disadvantage in power that can only be rectified by a severe skill gap in the players themselves.
     
  8. Norz!

    Norz! User

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    Well, so called "hardcore" Russian top clans spend their days PR'ing on L2C RU. If that says anything. And that's against people they have war with. (Therefore limited xp loss).

    If RU top groups rather PR than take a bad fight, I let you imagine what's gonna happen on EU.
     
  9. Woodzie

    Woodzie User

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    There are worse things than bsoe... I believe it doesnt matter what chronicle it is.. I was playing in GOD for few years. The famous pvp spot was parnasus. I take buffs from ch, port there to look around for wartags. And i see my 5-6 clannies full buffed near npc to enter baylor. 5 enemies hiting them (all my clannies not afk moving around and chating and with buffs ofc) and they doesnt atack back! They letting wartags to kill them with no problems! No self respect or no respect for the clan they are in! They just all die w/o even flaging! Then random comes and they enter dungeon dead... And ofc i die there.. After that i think that pr isnt the worst thing.. Or cheap as you say, since these days there are so many dumb ppl..
     
  10. Gottcha

    Gottcha User

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    Depends on the situation. If the numbers are even no reason to pr/bsoe unless someone went red by mistake. If you gank 1 pt : 1pt than PR after surprise is gone, why even go out and pvp. If 2 or more PTs roll up on 1 PT grinding than PR/bsoe all you want. Why give the gank squad the fun of killing you.
     
  11. G3n3s

    G3n3s User

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    i totaly dont get the point with bsoe, maybe it frustrated some pwna kiddoz when they couldnt kill someone who was xping or got heavily outnumbered ...
    there is absolutly no point in not using it and take -xp instead ... unless your brain aint working right xD
     
  12. Tirith

    Tirith User

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    I don't like bsoe nor do I particularly like PR, though to be fair, bsoe did save me a couple of times from dying while being red. You could say I was too attached to my gear. Normally I never used a bsoe. If me and my clan went to pvp I expected to get dropped, if I went exping while in war I also expected to be dropped. So while I was aware of that thought and knew the risks I was taking, I never bsoed away from a fight. Oh and the feeling of being ganged and actually wining a fight feels awkwardly good.

    Lineage 2 used to be all about smart decisions and carefully planing your next move or taking the right moment to pick on your enemy. You'd think twice before engaging in any kind of conflict. The introduction of bsoe and PR took a lot of that way. People went out exping or pvp without a grain of worry. The "I'll just bring a stack of bsoes and I'll be fine" sort of mentality or group PRs ruined a lot of, what could be, good pvp fights.

    Picking on lowbies? I don't even understand whats the point of that.
     
  13. KoolAid

    KoolAid User

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    I disagree Tirith. If I'm level 40+, once the grind starts to get rough, why wouldn't you bsoe or pr? That exp you lose will be gone and the time you took to get that exp will be gone. I do agree that it can be quite annoying to see other party's bsoe or pr, but that just part of this game.

    Yeah I agree, that is just useless...
     
  14. Maya Reinhartz

    Maya Reinhartz User

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    Competition is only fun if it's on par with your level or absurdly higher to inspire you to overcome them.

    An easy win outside of a tournament is just a waste of time.
     
  15. Orcoso

    Orcoso User

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    Everything depends...

    If you are killing low lvl that are actually in a clan war with you there are a few benefits.

    Easy clan points, and you are keeping your enemy from progressing.
     
  16. Tirith

    Tirith User

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    Perhaps you're right. Maybe it will be different for me this time around.

    I never looked at exp as something precious or something to worry about, given the fact that in Lineage 2 you exp 90% of the time. Hence why I dont see any point of running away from a fight. But maybe that's just me.
    I used to have a lot of time to waste on L2. Back in C2 when there was no bsoes, we were in a war with a more powerful clan. I died off 120% at 72 in a few days while pvping. Even though C2 was consideralby faster than prelude or C1, that took me a long time to gain back. It didn't made me quit. On the opposite, I hit 75 at the end of C2.
     
  17. Norz!

    Norz! User

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    Of course, but it should still feel "cheap". Although kinda fair game.
     
  18. Tirith

    Tirith User

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    That proved to be a move in a wrong direction.

    With a community as small as L2, you need competition. Running people into quitting by not letting them progress is similar as to ******* into your own coffee. After a while, there won't be anyone around to pvp with and that's no fun.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2015
  19. Orcoso

    Orcoso User

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    Not really, I can't see a reason why it would feel "cheap", not being able to safely xp during a clan is kinda the whole point of a clan war...

    yea, not really, it is just dumb to think you need to let your enemies level, make money, gear up, etc... that also defeats the point of a clan war.

    If the competition is well organized it will live for ages, maybe they will disband and other clans will come to take their places, it's been like that for years. You can't assume that your current competition is your only competition.

    a HUGE amount of l2 players just stay untagged or neutral till they are high lvl enough to compete and can't get the next gear/fun w-o a big clan.

    If you competition quit cuz they couldn't handle a regular clan war, they weren't real competition and would have left anyways, and have something more expensive to RMT when they did.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2015
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  20. Tirith

    Tirith User

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    I didn't say you NEED to let them prosper in order to have a healty competition. I said it's not wise to keep them from being able to advance by total suppression.

    I've seen it happen first hand. I've seen people being driven off server, quit or just losing the will to compete in end game events due to bigger clans oppressing them in every corner of the game. Whats the point in that?

    And no, I've seen well organized clans being turned to dust or never achive anything big due to supremacy of bigger clans.
     
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