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Help me choose dual box combo

Discussion in 'Class Discussion' started by Kamrooz, Dec 9, 2015.

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  1. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    Alright. Bare with the long post, got a lot on my mind and need some help from you lovely gents and ladies. I've been browsing around for hours just trying to figure out what I want to do. First things first, played Open beta till Pre C3 launch when I quit. I'm an NA player and was on the Bartz server originally.

    My brain is SCREAMING at me to choose an archer, either a HE or a PR in order to be PvP dominant (Not a Light Elf fan). I expected the ping to be TERRIBLE which would mean a huge click delay considering the servers are in Luxembourg. I tested WTFast on the core server and was surprised to see it was VERY similar to what I experienced in the original Bartz server back in the day. (Mind you I didn't use the leatrix latency packet fix in the past, big help along with WTFast. If you guys didn't know about it. Run a google search. MASSIVELY helps in mmo's).

    Now considering the delay isn't as bad as I thought. I'm considering playing my pride and joy from my old NA retail days. Had a TH and loved it (Hopped on TH BEFORE the FotM =P). Now I've played on and off on private servers in the past and fell in love with an AW as well as tested out skills that weren't in retail at the time of my play. Love the play style, although I loved the TH play style as well. Planning to dual box a buffer/healer with a Dagger or maybe even an archer class.

    But of course Here is what I have planned and know from my previous knowledge, as well as what I've read from the Korean classic l2 wiki. Any advice and tips would be appreciated. If I left something out, please let me know, might make or break my decision.

    These will just be direct comparisons between AW/TH

    TH: Dash, Fake Death, Crit Chance, Crit Power, and double cancel (Trick + Switch). The larger HP pool and large up time of dash is extremely alluring considering no one can run from you. Having crit chance and power is a big plus. Especially considering the range pvp aspect as I could switch to a bow in mass pvp, and still do decent damage during crits considering my higher levels of crit power/chance unlike archers. Yes my normal hit damage wouldn't be great, but the crits would at least be decent enough to be helping out in a meaningful way. Not as much as a actual HE/PR/SR crit considering passive bow masteries, but enough to make it viable. I would box a prophet with this since I would want them in the same starter zone. Fake Death might not seem that useful. But this is classic, takes a long time to level. Being able to train on people and fake deathing in DVC was a blast, and a good way to make money off loot drops and piss off rival clans (I'd like to point out I did not do this often in NA, I'm a good guy. But this is Lineage 2...Time to start some drama and have some fun =P).

    AW: Hex, Power Break, Crit Power, Two forms of bleed (Bleed and Sting), Freezing Strike to slow fleeing enemies. Now I know what most think when people bring up Hex and Power Break. That a BD will do this and always be in higher lvl parties. True, but how often does a BD have the mana pool to Hex every mob and keep up all their dances along with an SwS? Not very often at all...So being able to hex while I slap away with heavy crits from bd/sws/pp/wc buffs is a plus. Crit power will help in mass pvp when I switch to a bow for long range poking, not as good as the TH with crit chance but still decent with the right buffs. I would box a SE with this which is a negative and a plus. Vamp rage is nice and all, but with the non 100% proc rate rate nerf, I'd rather have Haste from a prophet as attack speed is a godsend for daggers. But moving a PP and a AW together to level at the beginning of the game will be quite difficult considering first class transfer quests. Now IMO the TH has better advantages. But when blinding blow comes into play. the movement speed buff will make it worth while (I remember a situation in the past using blinding blow on an ally during a chase. Speed boost was enough to get me in range to freezing strike the fleeing target and securing a kill on a rival clan's PW...Ohh the memories). Plus there won't be many AW's in comparison to TH's around. Which has some appeal. Plus I'm leaning towards AW's cause they just look so bad ***. =P

    Now there are skills I have no idea if they will make it or not into the game. Critical Blow, Blinding Blow, Mortal Strike, Lethal Blow, etc. Among the plethora of other skills I used in private servers back in the day after my retail days. I've been looking at the Korean Classic Wiki and seeing really just Focus Death, Focus Power, and Focus Chance on the 3rd class change list (Not sure if this is accurate or not, We are getting version 1.5 correct? is Korea farther ahead?).

    As you can see..I'm thoroughly torn in my decision. Do I go my beloved TH route and box a prophet which is the perfect buffing companion? AW with a SE and look farther down to the road for Blinding Blow among other things? Or listen to my scum bag brain ignoring my heart and go your average run of the day archer like most are.

    If I'm leaving out any skills to help me decide, please let me know. It's a gigantic mess in my brain trying to figure out what to do. Any advice would be appreciated considering how torn I am. :019:
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2015
  2. Hartassen

    Hartassen User

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    Simply put TH is the best dagger. Why? Dash and a large hp pool. Stuns have high landing rates in classic and a DE is going to spend his entire time either rooted or stunned. Beyond that, daggers are probably going to be the hardest class to level beyond dwarves, you might be able to get into archer parties if you have a bow but beyond that it's random parties doing single target leveling which is the worst way to level. Things will improve in the savior patch or "2.0" but that's like 1 year away. Then you will have shadow step and new blows etc. Go check out the patchnotes for that here: https://4gameforum.com/threads/541633/
     
  3. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    Tell my scum bag brain that. I agree in TH having the benefit. Don't get me wrong. In my eyes they are the best dagger class ATM. But down the road as new content/skills come out...That does indeed equal out (at least I hope so, who knows what they plan to do with classic). Which I am looking at long term. When I played back on the official servers during the launch days. I spent about 6-7 hours a day just under a year out of the 2-2 1/2 years I played the game (Was a dedicated CS player at the time). The rest of the time I put in about 12-15 hours a day. I was mostly a solo'er, buying prophet buffs and spamming soul shots with a high efficiency mind set (This was prior to Cruma tower). Got up to 68 before I sold my account. I remember what it was like and I honestly don't mind. Also plan to use that prophet to sell buffs as well down the road for money on the side (Will help when I'm too busy with work to grind, so I can just keep an eye on my monitor and sell buffs at forbidden gateway among other places.

    But yea...I'm heavily considering archer. It will be the easiest route. As well as the most optimum alongside mages for mass pvp as most plan to go that route. But dare to be different I say =P....As long as my heart and brain would at least go int he same direction. But they are not >_<.
     
  4. Azgaard

    Azgaard User

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    Gladi and PP?
     
  5. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    I probably should of phrased the topic better. As in should I pick TH + PP, AW + SE, AW + PP, OR HE + PP, or PR + PP...LOL...

    I noticed other people talking about the stun mechanic in classic being different. Has the percentage chance of stun landing increased? Making my AW choice even more difficult?
     
  6. geba89

    geba89 User

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    Well both daggers are equal I would say.

    IMO go for AW. He looks awesome, with PP box you will be able to solo a bit (still better to find some party) and HEX/PB helps in solo/small party.

    AW will not be so popular because of low CON compared to TH but I think it should be not so big problem (like it never was such problem).

    Prophet box will give you all buffs you need, VR is not needed as it wont help you at all, its so nerfed :(

    Only good things that TH got and AW lack is currently DASH, but it wont help you anyway because as dagger you will get killed before you come close to mage/archer :D

    But in next update you get hide since lvl 40 and you will be able to kill ppl easier :)
     
  7. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    Man this is a tough choice. One thing to consider though is if I do go AW, getting the prophet to him or getting the AW to the prophet will be a pain. Plus I have to keep transfer quests in mind. Now it shouldn't be that big a deal the more I think about it. Considering if I went TH + PP there quests wouldn't be in the same area. I'll have to bring the PP to DE Village in order to level her with my AW. Considering both class transfer quests start in gludio anyways. Also she's close enough to get to a human trainer for skills since she'll be on the main continent. This actually might work. Also she has heals for running through the water to get into gludin SoE range. Huh...Actually it all falls into place. The only thing is do I really want to drop a TH's Dash, Fake Death, Double Cancel, and Crit Chance for an AW. Now I know this will be WAYYYY down the road. But I have to think about Focus Death vs Focus Power. Also I believe Mirage is a more useful skill compared to counter attack. Does anyone know the percentage chance of the Mirage proc anyways? In theory sounds more op if it has a decent chance of canceling attacks. I mean 1 minute of a self buff that inflicts trick is pretty op depending on the percentage. While with counter attack, I'll have 10 seconds to transfer back melee attacks and skills unto the attacker. I wish this would of work against ranged magic/archers. I would pick it in a heartbeat if that was the case....lol
     
  8. wewdome

    wewdome User

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    It all depends on what updates are we going to get on classic but things so far show tgat the devs are at least trying to fix sone of the imbalance in the game.

    There are a few things that are very important to know before choosing a dagger class.
    1) future skills of update 2.0 were fully released today in korean, we expect them to be translated very soon.
    2) mechanic of physical skill criticals. Does it depent on crit chance or on str. There is a question about that in the official thread and we are expecting answer from the devs. Afaik, classic wont have the lethals mechanic, so many endgame skills will have to be revised.

    Bottom line is, i think, game devs will balance all daggers and most of other classes. Even pw will be good choice. I think it will all be down to what dyes you use.

    As far as perfect duo goes, best choice would be bd+sws and i can guarantee u will be wanted in every party. And u can solo pretty decent :)
     
  9. geba89

    geba89 User

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    Well don't you think quests are not a problem? PP is great buffer, AW with those buffs will have best DPS compared to any other buffer.
    Also we don't know all skills/updates yet. We only know that melee chars **** now, that's all.
    In any time it can happen that AW will become GOD CHAR but it can also happen that he will be so bad, that it will be played less than TK or Summoners.
    I would go for AW anyway, bad *** look, debuffs, good stats, nice skill set and best PVE dmg.
     
  10. ThreeNill

    ThreeNill User

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    Watch this - ; even without sound it makes for a good comparison. The CON difference is HUGE in classic. If you chose a dagger, you will be fighting an uphill battle. If you chose an AW you will be playing one of the most underpowered classes in classic right now (along with destro/warsmith). I consider PW being better than AW right now. There are new skills coming right in so you might wait for a better translation of Focus Power/Death/Chance and decide then. SR>PR right now as well (again, mainly CON).


    P.S. All daggers have "Throw Dagger" type of skill which is different. Also the values of Exciting Adventure/Ghost Walking/Wind Riding are different. (With TH's being the worst in my opinion). On the other hand TH has Mirage which is way better than Either Dodge or Counterattack
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2015
  11. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    Yea. This is a toughie. 9 Con difference between AW and TH is pretty massive. Have they changed the stun mechanics in L2 classic? Is it more consistent against low con races? Man...I Know I should make an archer. I absolutely know I should. But I really don't want to follow the trend....lol.
     
  12. wewdome

    wewdome User

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    Ppl say stun is about 50% more effective on classic. Archers are indeed strong, but warlords, gladiators and tyrants are the strongest fighter classes atm
     
  13. GangMasta

    GangMasta User

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    According the tests on russian servers, there is 95% land of stun, and its not depend on how much CON u have. It greatly depend on the difference between your lvl and lvl of the target (or lvl of skill of stun/stunshot etc and the target), so 4 lvls difference=only 50% chance to stun.10 lvl difference = as i remember well, 5% of chance to stun or something like that.
    So all CON give is how much hp/hp regen u have.
     
  14. wewdome

    wewdome User

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    Not true. Con is still a crucial mechanic in resisting stuns, even though level difference plays a big role. I remember reading that stun shot on h5 would land about 50%, in classic i saw values of 87%.
     
  15. GangMasta

    GangMasta User

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    I've just said about the results of hundreds of tests.
    So here we got a link: https://4gameforum.com/threads/535160/

    Its in russian, but i will translate. The point is they take 40 lvl Hawk Eye with eminence boow without buffs, and as an aim 40-60 lvl Hawk Eye without any buff too.
    They made a 100 stun shots to the aim lvl 40, 100 stun to the lvl 42, 100 to the lvl 44 etcetera.
    Results: 96% land rate on target lvl 40,
    92% on lvl 42,
    74% to the lvl 44,
    just 20% on lvl 46
    and 0% to the lvl 48 or higher.

    And Yes it is not the test about how strongly depend con on the land of stun rate, but as u can see, there is a chanse Very high to stun the same lvl opponent with 43 CON, and this is a VERY indicative result.
     
  16. wewdome

    wewdome User

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    Well 43 con is out of reach for most of the classes, so i guess stun IS pretty effective. It would be nice if we can see same testwith resist shock on.
     
  17. ThreeNill

    ThreeNill User

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    Indeed, I was not aware of this test. But it's then important how Resist Shock buff from EE affects this calculation. This means that dark elves are basically not inferior to other races, except for the sheer HP pool, which is negligible.
     
  18. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    So it seems it's more level dependent for stun shot. Now I'm not saying it doesn't affect con. But that is pretty alarming though. 92% chance to land on someone two levels higher than you?. It's pretty much guaranteed. I wish this could be tested against a DE to see how the percentages change. Cause if the success rate is that high. I wonder if it would even matter. Maybe it's just the percentages have risen drastically and it won't matter what class you pick. Although if the percentages on a DE are higher on the higher level characters as tested here from a HE to HE...It would definitely dissuade me. ****...Two weeks to go and no real way of testing this...FML....

    I'm still completely torn. Considering dagger still, but leaning more towards TH atm duo to the stun scenario. But if the stun percentages are around the same on the DE, I would pick the DE. This would save me so much grief if I just rolled a HE like everyone else -_-.
     
  19. wewdome

    wewdome User

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    The beautiful thing about this mechanic is that it doesnt matter so much anymore what race u play. This is good way to make daggers and tanks from all races competitive.
     
  20. Kamrooz

    Kamrooz User

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    That is true wew...If it doesn't matter about Con at that point. But let's say they took that test and threw in a DE instead as the target. If the percentages are the same as the test on the HE at same levels that is fine. But if there was a larger discrepancy between the two as the level gap grew..That would be a problem. As stated at 46 it was 20%...If that was like 50% on a DE due to Con, it would sway my vote for the TH. If only this was testable during the period from now till early access.

    Well...This is great, I'm just as torn as I started....lol...Halp :019:
     
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