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Open letter to Innova staff; Revive Lineage 2 EU Classic

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by !KniX, Apr 26, 2016.

  1. !KniX

    !KniX User

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    I realize this is a bit far fetched and possibly crosses the line of crazy but I love this game too much to not give this post a try.

    First off all I would like everyone to know that the game may not be perfect;
    * QHP Pots
    * BSOE
    * PK Scrolls
    * Item drop when dying in pve.
    List can be long, read DVP's post about what stuff shouldve never made it to the EU Classic server.. Lets not go into why it failed, lets try to look at how it can be successful.


    There was an event when we got +50% exp and it was even restricted to a certain group of players, everyone below level 70! -- And even within a time zone, 19:00-02:00! If innova can make XP adjustmens to the game im sure they could setup a schema that would benefit the avarage european.

    My idea is to use this for a good cause;
    - Restrict xp income for everyone, either by time of day or by total exp earned during 24 hours. But then, naturally other problems would occur -- such as players EXPing during night would spend their time ganking players during day when they themselves can't exp - come at me bro, i need to make my pvp movies. Well, that is a problem that is FAR less relevant than the one that is happening right now. Looking at it from a different Point of View; players that dont get xp on one char could spend their time lvling up an alternative character or even spend time farming. Either way this invites everyone to the game without missing out on the yolo players. This would make even me level up a spoiler, for fun!
    - By "classic" in "L2 classic" everyone thought it would be as it is right now but without this brutal XP curve, even I who absolutely love this game, feel that the XP Curve is just too god damn brutal! Change the XP standard to +200% of what it is now, the result would be x1 rates insted of x0.25 or w/e its concidered to be right now. Don't touch the spoil/drops - its perfect as it is.

    You could tweak this even more, such as xp lowers after 8 hours of gameplay; players get 25% LESS exp after a certain time instead of just 0%, this is to invite people to take a break. Im sure even the most hardcore player, living in a basement, would concider getting a job at that point.


    Simply put; Reviving the project with different set of parameters. With the the community as input, could make L2 flourish and you would have another wave of income!

    NCSoft failed due to bots. Innova learned from their mistake and is doing an amazing job banning botters but there's a different problem that Innova hasnt taken into concideration. People in basemens.

    I just laid out a business plan for you that you can build upon, you can thank me, and everyone who loves this game as much as i do, later. :)

    Please feel free to continue this thread with constructive feedback/input.



    TL;DR Reset server with settings that would allow the avg. joe to enjoy this game too.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2016
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  2. NoisyBoy

    NoisyBoy User

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    Maybe change the sub price to match the ru one would be a smart move, is a nonsense have identical server with different prices, and why pay 10€ for a 10 year old game?
    But right now thinking about a server reset makes me smile for many reasons, but mainly for the tears of who bought adena/chars for $$$, and innova know this, so no reset.
     
  3. Maya Reinhartz

    Maya Reinhartz User

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    This should've been posted in suggestions.

    And this is called Vitality. Only that it'd have a daily replenishment instead of a weekly one.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2016
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  4. Vhailor

    Vhailor User

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    You are not paying for the game, but for the server that hosts it.
     
  5. !KniX

    !KniX User

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    The vitality is a good example, except this wouldnt be absued with pots. This works the other way around - rather than XP Boost it encourages players to play more efficiently, unless they really DO want to get a lead with their main characters - the lead wouldnt be as huge as it is now.
     
  6. Maya Reinhartz

    Maya Reinhartz User

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    I dislike punishing players that put more time into the game but the game has been ravaged by the community so much I don't even care at this point.

    I think we're at a dilemma. It's obvious to everyone that major clans and even low-tier ones are RMTing their way up and that not only mechanics but the current status of the server allow for it.

    You people complain about Core being P2W but this is just as much and I can give several examples:
    • MadPro closes DV, all unique keymats and items to the place are locked under their control for price ranges with some very rare exceptions. The characters that sell these aren't necessarily under the MadPro banner because everyone makes an alt for that.
    • Mechanics motivate players to RMT in case of essential item drops, I mean you spent 5 months leveling a character but end up dropping your weapon, getting it back would only cost 5€... after all that time you're surely not going to stop, are you?
    • Clans that already own clan halls create a cheap Level 2 clan and snatch them for high prices, selling them for real money(remember the Dion duo with a "skype info:" as a message?) or just securing it for a future alt clan.
    I think it's obvious to everyone that plays here that real cash is a common currency, It's also obvious that Innova also knows about it but can't properly solve it. Why? Because if they do take action the server will have even less paying peeps. This means that who gets the worst out of all of this are us, small clans and legit players.

    There's no respect for mechanical limitations, there's no respect for fellow adversaries, there's no respect for people that have a different play-style and the worst of all is that "the game allows for it" is being used as an excuse. Yeah, say that to Queen Ant on Core that has strict rules despite no actual mechanical limitations.

    Immediate solutions:
    • Increase the limit of clan members(It should not have a limit to be honest)
    • Allow for one clan to take over multiple castles.
    • Actually understand that some people own multiple accounts and enforce limitations within these that prevent the easy access and take over of resources meant for multiple clans end up in the hands of a single one.
    You guys know that they intend to make Gludio sieges for "lowbie" clans right? Which would mean only Level 4 clans can participate in it. You know that's going to be complete bullcrap and Level 5 clans will still win it with an alt clan right?

    I don't know. Everything that the developers intend to do gets broken in a few days. I can't wait to win over you guys at Chateau and from second time on wards getting PKed on Springs port because you can do that. :Thumbsup:

    This isn't about what Innova is going to do anymore. It's about a culture that has been developing this way for over a decade, and how nobody ever stopped the general direction the game was taking. It's a stupid and broken old game that has been broken for too long... So even if we were to fix it the players would complain.

    So understand that dilemma before you complain about RMT. Please, it's not on Innova at this point. They have to tolerate these things or we'll really be dead. :confused:
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2016
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  7. waz__

    waz__ User

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    Its nice see that some players dont give up from the server ^^

    We wait too much to have a classic server and we spend hour of our life playing to have some fun... and its really sad see our game dying ._.

    About the merge with Shilen is not a good solution? ^^ I like the idea.

    good job on post Knix ^^ i hope that Innova make something to revive the server!
     
  8. !KniX

    !KniX User

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    @Maya Reinhartz i agree with everything except the point about 1 clan having multiple castles .. ehhh ok.
     
  9. ComedyL2c

    ComedyL2c User

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    transfer us to shillien/gran kain - is the best solution :)
     
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  10. Fragola

    Fragola User

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    afaik, already implemented in 2.0
     
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  11. Maya Reinhartz

    Maya Reinhartz User

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    If clans can't have multiple castles there'll be alt clans even if there's no limit on how many members can be in one. It's a necessary change. Game Design 101.

    Just goes to show you treat this like any other server that is opened through unlicensed means. I came here with a long-term plan, to play this game at a slow pace and see progress coming in months, years even instead of weeks.

    The way you treat this game is so lacking of affection that I have no idea why you haven't left already.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2016
  12. SonicYouth

    SonicYouth User

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    i couldnt agggrreee more on that!!

    i think this "limited xp thingy per day" was a common/popular feature on games in china or somewhere. i rly like it. i mean cmon, lets say ~ 50-60% of the l2 players, especially classic, are ppl who are ~26y+ at least.
    peeps who still love this game so much and are familar with mechanics like losing xp on death, pk and so on.

    ppl like many of us, old farts lurking around, tryin out other pvp/sandbox mmos and always "coming back" to L2 couse no other game has this spirit and this imo awesome pvp-system. ppl which dont have sooo much time any more to spent on a game or willing and able to sacrifice life for it. couse of jobs, gf, wife and kids but who just cant stop couse every time you hear about an OFFICIAL L2 server your heart is pumping faster.

    We problably wont get any other or new chance to ever again get into official L2 again so this could mby be our last stand to make this happen again for good.



    one fact is clear for me: you CANT bann RMT from games. this is more or less a fact. but tbh i couldnt care less. i dun give a **** about it. who feels better with it, go for it.


    - limited time for XP awesome 0-4h/100%, 4-6h/50%, 6-8h/10%
    - pay2play 8-10€ per ACC
    - "old" xp curve (be true to yourself, old L2 xptable was strong enuff)
    - EU server but RU/US welcome
    - Bot protection like now! (good job innova <3)
    - !!!!!!! OLD IN WAR icon (neon-pink doublefists) !!!!!!! :D
    - if ure rly scared of advertisment innova just buy one full site in the most famous gaming magz EU/RUS/US one time or do some good facebook work and let ppl LIKE it

    - u dont need to nuke Skelth, but i guess nobody would play here any more if u bring this true new server. who would go on here? nobody! couse all would enjoy and stay on the new one where everybody has fun for a long time. the only ppl screaming imo guys who feel strong on godlike xp advantage.


    hope this wont end up in a flame thread for once, lol

    @ KNIX thx for bringing up this thread. still remember you gettin chicken-hunted on l2blah .gif ;DDDDDDDD
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2016
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  13. baritskiy

    baritskiy User

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    I would call my friends, and they would come, but.. who wanna play on dead server for 10 EU?
    Decrease it to 5EU and population will be much better, at least because a lot of ppl will pay for their boxes.
     
  14. SweetDreamZ

    SweetDreamZ User

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    I got 1 for you guys.

    How about we move all 60+ Characters to L2Ru Classic servers :D
    or
    How about we move all Russians to L2Ru Classic Servers :p


    And guys please stop with this ohh ppl dont wanna play here cause they cant box pp+se+bd+sws.

    Stop boxing stuff and take a real player in party instead !
     
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  15. Fei

    Fei User

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    Seriously Knix your thread not gonna change anything, Innova don't own Lineage II and if they should have changed something it was 8 month ago...

    Server has been managed by Russians amateurs, INNOVA team sheduled a start server during Christmass for Europeans... with a 5 day delay annoncement, with some stupid nolife unbalanced XP boost event.
    Skelth full of RMT/bots from the begining, Russians players shouldn't have been allowed to play on EU server, since you cant blame RU worker on L2 when they can win more money in a week playing a game than doing a "real" work (if they find one).
    Very few Russians was on Skelth for gaming, it was only for business, Russians who wanted to play L2 already had their own server : Gran kain and Shilien
    Was so boring to participate in clan/leader meeting discussion to realize that everything is connected to RMT on Skelth, people don't even talk about the game or politics but only about "business", adena price, character selling etc...

    L2 Classic is full of stupid feature and totaly unadapted to europeans players :
    -Xp curve is dumb as hell, go explain to a new player that hes gonna be Sws only at Lv55 in 4 month, until then hes just gonna run in circle or push a macro every 10 minutes.
    -No siegeable CH ? so no event for smaller structure than zerg... So only RU RMT can monopolize the CH market and sell them for real money
    -Free BSOE / Free PK scroll
    -L2 Classis "hardcore" well some people was Lv70+ after 1 month, HARDCORE ONLY if you are anything than mage who can train/AoE a whole area...
    Go explain to your member who ruined their christmass vacation to geek 10hours day and reach Lv40+ that some Russian are already 70+ cause they are """"BETTER"""".
    -Siege castle bonus over the top, and new items for more RMT
    -Let's don't forget the skill unbalacement, like Fatal counter, broken nuker cast speed/crit m.rate
    -The usefullness of Summoners and melee class in general...
    etc etc list goes on

    This server don't deserv your time, this server don't deserv your money, it don't deserv any investment, guess why i left ?
    Don't feed Russians anymore, move on ! this L2 Classic isn't even half good as C2/C5 era anyway

    Yeah let's transfer Comedy pt to Shilien so they can start to play after destroying Skelth, all those Epic Jewel need some action !
     
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  16. real Kvo

    real Kvo User

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    ++++

    I wrote a load about it on reddit recently, right before the sieges.

    The truth is, that the server was affected by a toxic mixture of; amateur management, broken chronicle, mad Russians and old Europeans - and of course the recent politics.

    Let's face it; we were given a chronicle that is broken. The PK scrolls just completely undermined the whole PK system. The classes are extremely imbalanced also. There are reasons why there were changes in 2.0.

    There are things that we will never get rid of, and that we can just turn a blind eye to - that is RMT. There will always be ways of transferring money for in-game stuff. As far as there is demand, there is supply.

    I find it curious, that NA/SA were blocked, while Russians dominated the server, due to (I like this one~) basement-playing. I have no dilemma which ones I would prefer.

    As to people exping in the basements - I think a vitality system would work well in this case. Make it free-to-play, introduce a vitality system with replenishment every day - but those you have to pay for. This makes the game effectively p2p, while still having the illusion of being f2p. This brings pees for Innova, and makes the game technically possible to play for free.

    I think the exp could be increased. But I, personally, would be happy with a 30% or 50% increase.

    A big problem is that there is little to do. The events that Innova brings are super-boring. Bring some pig-hunting, pumpkin-growing fun-having events! The server is four months old, damn it, and the only semi-decent one was the Valentine's one. Maybe I'm being acting like a rollplayer, but still. There is no contestable Clan Halls (HS one was epic - and literally anyone had a chance to get it). Bring some TvT events or summin, I dunno. Make it fun! Why else are you here, Innova? Sure, well done you banned bots. But this is not where your job ends.
    I'm absolutely against the idea of a merge, however.
    This server hit the rock bottom - and the question is, can it bounce back? And how can it?

    I care about this game, and I care to have fun. I don't think the Classic is tragic, and I think it is the only chronicle of L2 where I can still play and have fun. But this needs people. This needs management. I even tried to burn my bow to quit, but failed. The problem for me now, is that I have no one to play with.

    As to the wipe, should this happen, I'd start again - a thousand times over. But I'm not certain others could share this attitude.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 5, 2016
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  17. Fragola

    Fragola User

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    you are lucky, RU servers had no events for 6 months from the start.
     
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  18. real Kvo

    real Kvo User

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    Heh.. Lucky... heh xD

    Anyways, that just proves the point. But if ru population were happy with it, then perhaps the Innova staff is not experienced nor competent to manage a server for europeans.
     
  19. Fragola

    Fragola User

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    No, it wasn't. You think that merging 3 ru servers into 1 happenned because everybody was happy to farm 1.0 without sieges and events for 6 months?
     
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  20. Micaelis

    Micaelis User

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    Remember that at the end of the day Lineage 2 is a player driven sandbox game and its population is supposed to generate a lot of their own motivation to play. One cause of population decrease is player failure to be self sufficient in an environment reminiscent of the original state of nature.

    I do agree that Innova has made some weird decisions that haven't helped the server grow as much as it could have, but they really haven't actively killed it either. They have let it operate with minimal intervention, the way the game was intended.

    Is this genre of game impossible to successfully run in the west in 2016? I'm not sure, but I'm still having a great time individually and my clan has been able to largely recreate the feeling of camaraderie that was present in Lineage 2 circa 2005. As long as the server is here, we will be here to play on it.